Treating Founder (Chronic Laminitis) without Horseshoes
Guest book posts, 2005
Gretchen Fathauer's replies are in RED.
Date:
Thanks for great information. I have a horse that recently foundered due to "getting into the feed bucket," which I thought was out of reach. So I was looking for more information on laminitis. Thanks for a great website. Rebecca Reed rreed@chipsnet.com
Gretchen, my thanks to you for your comprehensive and extremely informative website. While I have been attempting to learn the "natural Strasser trim," your website has been an invaluable "reference" in helping me organize and sort through such a large volume of important information. It has encouraged me to attempt the trim on my horses and be more and more successful as I increasingly gain experience and knowledge. Kudos to you and your commitment!! Gale Hair Archer, Florida shadywd@earthlink.net
Great site. The most comprehensive I've seen and the answer to a lot of mysteries.
Wonderful resource for those of us with suffering animals. Thank you so much.
I have enjoyed your site and intend to read and reread it for a great educational site. I found your site thru Martha Olivo's web site. I have a mare that the vet and farrier were talking about putting down, but I attended Martha's clinic, and talked her into coming to my farm and looking at Crystal. She recovered with the natural trim and with a total changed life style. I have 40-plus horses and none have shoes. Thanks! Hampton Briggs, La Union, NM walkers4all@yahoo.com
I am a beginner farrier and enjoyed the info. cc ranch@acegroup.cc
jscottr@att.net Thank You for the info! We have a 10 yr. old Haflinger that is part of our family who has foundered. We are attempting recovery.
Someone gave my 11 year old daughter a foundered pony. This same man was surprised 3 months later that she was still alive. He had bought her at auction for fifty dollars because he felt sorry for her. Her feet were like elve's shoes. She was very skinny and could hardly walk. We had the farrier out immediately and he started to work on her. There aren't many farriers that will work on a foundered pony. I am still not sure if he is doing a good enough job. My husband is going to start trimming her himself. Any advice is welcomed. By the way, my daughter named her Grace, because by the grace of God, she will get well.
I have learned a tremendous amount, and am grateful for the photos and other information. Any information about quarter cracks would be useful, too, as I think those are also pretty common problems. Bdwinell@claytongrp.com
Great web site, a lot of good information. We just got in a 2yr old QH gelding that has foundered. So I can really use your site for him. I sure wish you were closer to Ca. I could really use your hay. We pay $12.00 a bale here, for 125 lb, 3 wire. We go through 4 tons a month. Keep up the good work. Thank You So Much--Safe Haven Horse Rescue & Sanctuary safehavenhorse@aol.com Web Site: www.safehavenhorse.tripod.com
What a great site. I have a huge Appy and a donkey that had/have laminitis. Our new farrier is doing a great job of fixing them up without shoes. They are both trotting their way around the pastures, and neither seems to be in any pain, FINALLY. I had several recommendations to put them on bute and hope for the best, but the Appy is my teacher/instructor for riding. He is helping me to regain confidence after by-pass surgery--there was no way I could just mask/cover the symptoms. Thanks for all the information Beth......somajikus@yahoo.com
Great site. A friend of mine has a horse with laminitis. He has got to the stage the vet is saying, you may have to think of having him put down. I am printing all this out and passing it on to her, then Luke can maybe free from pain, also. Wish we had qualified Strasser farriers here in Western Australia, or a clinic. How would you trim a sound horse th's not had anything wrong? The same way? I want to get my horse barefoot, also. If I send you pics, would you be able to advise on how to trim? Carol Davies nagmad@bigpond.com.au
A sound horse would have a similar trim, but just not with the toes backed up as much. You could contact Scott Kroeger, who co-ordinated Dr. Strasser's recent tour in Australia, for contacts: skroeger@bigpond.net.au
Hi, cannot thank you enough for this wonderful site. Last summer one of our horses got foundered. We tried nearly two months to have her shod with pads, and all that is available to relieve her, but she was always in pain. One day, I browsed the Internet to check if there was not more information to help relieve our horse. I came onto your site. We are doctors, neither professional hoof trimmers, but we followed the instructions, and yes, our horse was relieved instantly. This site is no joke--it is real and full of common sense. An hour after we trimmed the horse it was trotting in the corral!!! Many people came to our place and saw it; they can testify. We continue to trim the hoof like you say on the site, and our horse is happy and able to live. Without your site, we were thinking of putting down this horse to relieve her, she was so in pain. I can send you pictures if you want. Heidi (our mare) will be bred this summer, and she rides, gallops, and does everything a normal horse is supposed to do. There are not enough words to thank you for making this information available world wide. I live in Northern Ontario (Hearst), we are a hundred miles south of James Bay. We do not have hoof specialists in the area. The vets we have are for cows. Without your silent help, my mare would be dead by now. Thanks again a million times. Continue the good work. Sincerely, Marlene Belanger mabel@ntl.sympatico.ca Hearst Ontario
You're doin' a real fine thing here. LEZA Horsesmithing@webtv.net
Thank you for the information you provide.. our horse we just purchased was foundered... we have been told that there was no cure and the horse would be lame... you have just given us hope...thank you...flathd53@gate.net
I have watched my cousin and good friend struggle and succeed through the transition to barefoot horses using the Strasser trim. At first I thought they were nuts, but secretly I was curious and content to sit back and watch the results from afar. My Paint/TB gelding's "weakest link" are his feet and if I ever have down time when I cannot ride, it is because of his feet. When my shoer put on aluminium wedges to correct his underslung, contracted heels I wondered how this worked, as it really did not make sense to me. With the wedges he constantly shifted and pointed one toe or the other. On the next shoeing Brew had whiteline disease, so we pulled his shoes to let the air get at his barefeet and combat the whiteline. It was exactly what I needed to get me on the path I had been agonizing over for almost a year now. Your web site has been a wonderfully comprehensive resource of support, information and encouragment. I am one of the lucky ones to have a soon to be certified trimmer right here in my area and he has just given Brew his first trim and will help me out until I have the knowlege and confidence to start my own trimming. Thank you for such a wonderful contribution. Heather Dickson
I have a 24 year old Arabian, who foundered this past fall. He was then diagnosed with Cushings. My vet and I believe that the Cushings brought on the founder. He has been treated in the traditional method with shoes and medications, but does not seem to be getting any better. I just found your stuff on the web, and I think it makes more sense than the other way. I have copied your articles and given it to my vet and blacksmith to read and afterwards discuss with me. My problem is I board my horses and they can't be turned out 24/7, where they are. I don't know of any stable around this area thaat will allow this, but I am going to start looking. I think I will let the owner of the stable where I am read this and see if she won't make arrangements for this to happen for my horses and any others that would like to keep their horses out. Thank you very much for all the interesting information. It is great. Shirley Hamilton<hheagle24@yahoo.com>
Just looked at a Haflinger gelding, 8 years old. Never having to deal with this situation, I came here for information.. Great site, I have much studing to do before I decide wether to buy him. Thank you! Susan Johnson sjohnson@cape.com
Your site is wonderful, and I'm sure has been a big help to many people, myself included. I purchased a horse from an auction in Colorado (the worst one in the bunch). He was skinny and lame, but there was something about his face. I found a copy of Jaime Jackson's book by accident at the library and was convinced it would help me. Then I found your site on the internet. I have been cautious in trimming, but Soldier is much improved and getting better every day. Thank you so much. maureen.gould@att.net
Wonderfully helpful site. I am a third year vet student doing some work on foundered horses and I found your website extremely useful, thanks. Sarah Brighton SezB@freenet.co.nz
Your website is great. I have almost given up hope for my mare. Age 24, nothing seems to be working--she has been on bute and other drugs with no relief. I have tried backwards shoes, and all types of pads. She is spending a lot of time laying down, now getting sores on her hips, and the leg opposite the bad is now swollen. We have tried trimming this way. I plan to give my blacksmith your notes. Thanks a million. Debbie king Comet651@aol.com
The swelling could be an abscess getting ready to come through out the coronet band. This often looks and feels like a bowed tendon, even when it is not. Long soaks in warm water and apple cider vinegar, and walks as often as you can get her up for, will speed the resolution of hoof abscesses.
Hello from Austria! I read through your page all day long over the weekend. Much information, very well illustrated with the photos - Congratulations. One question arose: How is it considered in the trim when the horse has not perfectly styled legs (e.g. toe-wide and so on)? Regards, Margit m.papauschek@grapheus.at
If the lateral balance is off, this could contribute to the problem. The surefire way is to get good x-rays both from the front and the side of each hoof. From the front, the coffin bone should be ground-parallel. From the side, it also should be ground-prarallel.
Wonderful article about collection without force!!! Thanks!
It is great, I think you are doing a great and informative service to get a better understanding of and preventing founder. Thank you on my part..Raul
Have you thought about moving South? We need farriers in the Mobile, AL area.
Thanks for the site! I just bought a pair of colts with rather long hooves. No obvious problems yet, but I am anxious to learn the best way to trim them. noraclopton@yahoo.com
This system has literally saved the life of a foundered 9 yr old Connemara mare. The coffin bone had come through her soles, and the vets offered to put her down. After a natural trim, repeated every 2 days for 2 weeks, and walking 16 kms per day over varied ground, she is happy, perky, not footsore, and being lightly ridden in a kids' holiday programme. jackie_davidson @hotmail.com
www.home.earthlink.net/~gdacuncius gdacuncius@earthlink.net I was lucky enough to have worked with a gentleman that corrected foundered horses. I am looking for a foundered horse to work with now preferably in the type that we are currently breeding, as on our website. Also have an article on saddle fit that you may find interesting. It should be in Performance Horse.
Thanks for the information on the bitless bridles made by the Amish. Very nice lady on the phone! Dr Cook's prices seemed a bit high, considering that I didn't know the product. I have to get back to the shop with measurements, but I am ordering one today. I have a 4 year old quarter in a snaffle I just bought. He already has a natural headset. How do you think he will do with the bitless bridle, and can I take him on a trail ride with it after only a few rides? Sincerely Jacklyn Fuller jacklyne@peoplepc.com
I'm reading with intense interest. I have only just stumbled across this method and quite frankly, can't get enough. Whilst I have not had shoes on any of my horses for years, the last pair was 'heartbar'. I hate to admit i, but I didn't know any better at the time. I hope that many more people stumble across your website, just as I did, and it changes their direction for good. Thank you. Donna White, Brisbane, Australia dwhite@mccullough.com.au
Your web site is amazing, so helping and nice for the horses. My name is Natalia and I live in Spain, I have a foundered horse and I am very miserable about it, but now I have some hope, thanks to your information. Thank you for all the work you are doing. My e-mail address is: eanava@lugo.usc.es
Hi, I enjoy browsing your very informative web-site!! I would like to know if you or anyone has ever had any experience with coffin bone cysts? My 18 year old QH was finally diagnosed with this condition after many years of on and off lamenesses. About 7 years ago it was discovered that the coffin bones in both front feet were rotated. Egg bar shoes and concussion pads were put on the front feet and a regimen of 24 - 30 isoxuprine pills per day was started. Then last summer he started to go lame about once a month. It was first determined that the lameness were caused by abscesses. Soaking would alleviate his soreness, but I would never see any pus burst. Then my vet thought that he had Pedal Osteitis. Finally he sent my horse's x-rays to an orthopedic vet and then they discovered the cyst on the coffin bone of the left front foot. I removed his shoes in December 2001. He seems to be a lot sounder since removing his shoes, but I am not sure if he will ever by rideable again.
Any information you could give me would be greatly appreciated!!
Thanks, Cindy Geary cjgeary@adelphia.net
I wanna learn more regarding horse shoeing. Can you give me school where I can enroll? I'm from Manila. Jessie Dela Cruz my e mail address jessiebomb@yahoo.com
Why would I recommend a shoeing school when I am advocating an approach that does not use shoes?
Wish I had been to your web site sooner.
Have listened to "conventional vet wisdom" and had no access to a farrier who really understands the anatomy and physiology of laminitis.
New regimen means off with the shoes, no more bute, continue hydrotherapy in the creek! Need to read further about nutrition.
This 24 year old quarter horse went into the spring overweight. The pastures have been magnificent from the standpoint of baling hay, but a a bummer for this formerly sound, athletic horse.
Appreciate the "natural" approach to recovery.
God made these animals and he also provided a means for them to withstand laminitis. Human brilliance will never supercede The Perfect Plan.
Going with gusto to undo the damage I have inflicted on this great horse.
Barbara Liles barby@netease.net
This is an excellent site, very informative. We at Miracle Horse Rescue, Inc. have just recently received a beautiful, 10 year old mare with hoof resections. This is our first encounter with this.
Stephanie and Robert Pierce Miracle Horse Rescue www.miraclehorse.com
Me parece una opinion muy acertada sobre esta patologia ojala otras personas o profesionales se guien por sus concejos y no utilicen otros metodos como la tenectomia tecnica que he observado lesiona mas en lugar de mejorar, comparto su teoria y la he puesto en practica con resultados favorable. Dra. Nadyleyd Alvarez D. cascosyalgomas@hotmail.com.
Thanks so much for having all the information and pictures, My horse started with laminitis just three weeks ago and my farrier is interested in what I told her I found on your web site. I'm getting Dr. Strasser's book. This information you have will get my farrier started until the book comes. I'm feeling more hopeful after reading your web page! I'm in the San Diego area of Southern California and as of yet there is no one I could find trained in Dr. Strasser's methods. My vets have already used the drugs and want to use pads, more drugs and special shoes. I'm going to have them read your page, also, in hopes they don't fight me on this. Thanks again, Sherry Powell sherrypowell@covad.net
Have you heard of anyone in the UK who could show me how to trim my laminitic pony's feet properly. Jacquie Burrage ucando@supanet.com
UK hoofcare specialists:
Jane Berresford, Kilburn, Derbyshire (Midlands), JaneBerresford@aol.com
Kathy Clark, Hertfordshire, Kathy.A.Clark@btinternet.com
Fiona Dean, Warwickshire, dulimie@dulimie.demon.co.uk
Jillie Gardiner, South Wales, JillieGardiner@aol.com
Phone 07970 629726 (mobile); 01267 202239 (Land line)
Jane Harbidge, Warwick, janeharbidge@hotmail.com
David Jones, Wales, rosemarywj.starsunlimited@virgin.net
Tracey Kelly, West Moors, Dorset, Tracey@epona.fsbusiness.co.uk
Phone: 01202 891264
Anne Kempton, Leicestershire, barefootisbest.anne@virgin.net
Jane Kempton, Winchester, Wedolene@aol.com
Erica Lynall, Bath, England, mail@ericalynall.co.uk
Phone: +44 (0)1225 314121 (Will travel.)
Melanie Eileen Richards, Shropshire, Mark-Mel@horsetlc.fslife.co.uk
Mary Walker, Essex, mary.walker@db.com
Phone 020 8984 1977
Hi Gretchen--thank you for providing such clear diagrams and instructions. I am new (May 13, 02) to the barefoot approach, but I am determined to stick with it. Never having trimmed my previously foundered horse's hooves (or any hooves), I was shown how to do it by someone who did a clinic with Strasser. My horse is using Old Mac boots when I ride and doing well (except some rubbing on the pastern). Now I realize I need some pictures and specifics before I can try to trim. I live in a very remote area and even the man who did the initial barefoot trim is not very accessible (although he was wonderful). Your information seems to be just what I need, although some terms are a bit foreign (quarters of hoof? bars?) I'm probably too "green" to really be doing it, but if my horse is going to get a natural trim it has to be by me. So thanks for the info! Mona Johnson "mwmjohnson@hotmail.com"
Where are you? You need hands-on trimming instruction. You could find some clinics listed in my Section 5
and more contacts here:
www.naturalhorsetrim.com/past_hosts.htm
www.thehorseshoof.com/friends.html
Gretchen, your website has been a wealth of info. Without it I never would have been able to keep my horses' shoes off 4 years ago when I pulled them in disgust after another missed appt. by the farrier. I found resources and information that has helped me keep him barefoot all this time and have a happier horse to boot. Thank you. Carmen thunderbun@juno.com
Your web site is an answer to prayer! I had almost given in to the conventional, inevitable solution to rotated coffin bone - euthanize!
Now, I desperately need to learn about this new "trimming" procedure. Leroy is finally barefoot. How do I lower his heels? I'll keep researching until I find a "how to." I'm also looking for Dr. Strasser's book "The Hoofcare Specialist's Handbook."
Thank you for giving me hope. Sincerely, Denise Forbes denisef@co.mason.wa.us or sdforbes@qwest.net
To order the hoofcare specialist textbook, Click HERE
Thanks for all the great info. My mare foundered this last week 6/6/02. Thank heaven it wasn't too bad. It's really great to see what is happening within the horse's hoof and be able to gain a better understanding. Thanks for the time you have spent on this website.
Gina :) jhuttonpureracing@yahoo.com
Excellent site and information
Robert and Stephanie Pierce Miracle Horse Rescue, Inc. Pahrump, Nevada www.miraclehorse.com rescue@miraclehorse.com
Hello, fellow horse enthusiasts! Upon, this, my initial visit to this site, I realize that before I can give a really honest opinion of what I think of it, I need to invest more time studying it than I have available tonight. However, I am comfortable stating that I think it may be a place that I will want to visit often. I found the site whilst searching for articles on the treatment of Thrush and laminitis, as well as articles on how to prevent the same. I adopted a 3 year old rescue filly, whom I love more than any other horse I have ever owned. She's simply a jewel, and is in wonderful health, thank God. In addition, I am happy to report she has wonderful feet, and that's saying something, considering the amount of rainfall we are blessed with here in the southern Willamette Valley in the state of Oregon: @ 60" to 80" of RAIN per year. YUCK. As a native of Southern Oregon, High in the Cascades of the upper Rogue River Valley (A slice of sheer heaven @ 2700 ft., having 30" to 35" of precipitation per annum) even after 20 some years in residence, I find the Willamette Valley's rainfall OPPRESSIVE- Not to mention HELL on horsie paws. Nevertheless, I DO have to remain here a while longer; in the meantime, I want my darling little filly's hooves to STAY healthy. Any friendly tips on keeping them in good condition in a muddy land would be WELCOME. Mrs. M.M.V. coyotecreststudio@earthlink.net
Keep up the awesome work! I'm so impressed with this site! I have been looking up everything I can possibly find on laminitis/founder. Yours struck a chord. I want to find a Strasser clinic now!
Just a note to tell you that I have had miraculous results on a chronic laminitis (not sure if foundered) mare with massage! She couldn't walk out of her stall on my first visit and when I came back the next day the owner was so happy because the next morning she trotted out to her pasture. She does go lame again, though. I did witness the results of the massage myself the next week. I don't think the owner is taking care of her feet. She was lame in her back feet the last time I was there and I dug out gravel imbedded in mud! Made me mad! She has to make her way across a gravel driveway and the owner only checks her horses feet once or twice a year! (She rescues these horses from death, so I figure she thinks she's done her job! I just met her so I don't want to pry just yet!) I'd like to find her those boots the Australian guy mentioned. Do you know where I can find them? She doesn't wear shoes and now I'm going to check her hooves with my new template you provided. I hope the owner will let me experiment with her.
Thank you so much for this site! I'll spread the word!
Terrie L. Burrell, ESMT II tlburrell@ideanetworkinc.com
More Info on Old Macs--click HERE
I agree that massage is an important aid in rehabbing foundered horses. Especially when you lower the heels quickly, the more movement and massage, the better. The "founder stance" takes tremendous muscular tension to maintain; habitual tension needs to be addressed if the horse has been in this stance for any length of time.
Sue Crews Great site.....thanks for the info.
suecrews@netscape.net
Hi, my name is Jeff Vanden Heuvel, I am a certified master farrier with the BWFA. I shoe horses for a living. I feel there are always opportunities to learn. I have been there and done that. Some of this that I have been looking at here I have been doing for a long, long time. I guess by gut instinct. Very informative. I have people asking me for this. It is very hard to swallow some of it, but you're never too old to learn. I pride myself in helping horses with feet problems, so this will be added in my list of options. Azshoer@aol.com
What I am advocating is to trim the outside of the hoof to more nearly match the internal structure's shape...as opposed to having the sole 3x thicker in the heels than the toes, and the like. This only makes sense mechanically. Glad to hear from you.
This is a very informative site. You've presented clear, compelling reasons for your strategy of handling the foot problems!!! I have a 26-year old Appaloosa mare who experienced a brief founder episode 3 months ago. After reading your material, I feel that I know what should be done to help her recover...... Which brings out a question: Is there a time course over which one can expect the horse to recover? I try to exercise her 3-4 times per week using a long line.....maybe 20 minutes. She's reluctant to move faster than a walk......virtually never more than a brisk trot. Prior to the laminitis episode she was definitely more active --- although not a ball of fire, by any means. I want to restore as much health as possible. With proper foot trim, is there any suggested exercise routine for maximum rehabilitation? What about dietary supplements?
Thanks for putting out such a good analysis!!
Dwight Sutton
e-mail: dsutton@bainbridge.net
Exercising only 3-4 times a week is not enough! She needs to be hand-walked many times a day--sorry to be the bearer of bad news! It is hard to predict how long a rehab will take when there are so many variables. Hold off asking for a trot, and she will do better being walked in straight lines instead of circling on a long line. Tight turns and faster paces stress the white line more than walking in straight lines.
I found your site to be easy to navigate and the articles very informative and understandable by the lay person. The diagrams and photos are extremely helpful in furthering the understanding of the article content.
Bobbi Leone RedChooch@screaminet.com
Great site! Have a navicular mare that's only 12 yrs old. Diagnosis with navicular at age 8. Was given to us at age 10 when the traditional "eggbar shoes and wedges" quit working. We also tried the traditional heel lift shoes 2 years ago. They wouldn't stay on and didn't help her any. Took shoes off and let her go barefoot last 2 years. But no improvement with the "traditional barefoot trim". Just found out about the Strasser barefoot trim. She's scheduled for a trim shortly with a certified Stasser farrier, and I just know she's going to improve, but will have to heal first. Can't hardly wait for the farrier to arrive!!! Neither can she, but she doesn't know that yet!
Mary equstrncntr@aol.com
You have a great web site. I also in need of Swiss horse boots. I need three pair size 2 Bobbie Leister bobbie_ms@yahoo.com
You may find some deals on used ones HERE or new boots in Section 18
Just to say thanks for all your hard work!! This web site is wonderful and I've learned so much. My horses are all barefooted now and doing better than ever. I've learned how to trim them myself, and I'll never go back to shoeing. Sincerely, Molly mgamble@2z.net
Hi, Valerie: I love your website; thank you for sharing your trimming challenges with your beloved Max He looks like he's quite the character as does that enormous mule! :-) I've been riding since I was about 9 months old and trimming horses' hooves since I was about 9. I've paid farriers their normal fees and then done the work with them coaching me. But I am VERY interested in all that I've been reading and trying with this kind of trim. As I learn more, I have no doubt that I'm making my share of mistakes with trimming my own horses, especially my 29 year old Welsh/Quarter Horse and my 30 year old Appaloosa. But your website with all your wonderful pictures has been enormously educational. I plan to get Dr. Strasser's book and have already read Jaime Jackson's book and watched his video. Thanks much for the explanation of the differences between the two. I also have a 7 year old Peruvian Paso and a long-pasterned yearling Quarter Horse filly. I'm trying to do all of them justice with this trim. If you know of anyone who has tried this with Peruvians or has any experience with Peruvians and anything different that needs to be done, would you mind letting me know so I could e-mail them? I would really appreciate this! Thanks again! Susan Montgomery-Hodge, Ft. Lupton, CO hat@cfaith.com
Valerie was in a couple of photos, but my name is Gretchen. :-)
Many gaited horse owners find their horses going better, not worse, with this kind of trim.
Gretchen --- I tried to phone you to receive more information about your trimming technique. We have a QH, who was just diagnosed with a "slightly" rotated coffin bone. He has been bare foot for one year since we got him as a companion pet for our older mare (32), who just passed away last September. Our vet has recommended putting styrofoam "shoes or pads" on his front feet for right now. And, we are giving him Banamine twice daily. "Jr." is extremely sore on his front feet. The soreness came on quite suddenly. We have been keeping him in a relatively small paddock with virtually no grass due to the drought we are having here in MD. Jr. is not ridden, he is just a pet. We want to do what is best for him. Any advice you can provide would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you,
Janet Bradley janet.a.bradley@usdoj.gov (301) 924-0299 (Mother's farm phone #) (703) 827-2793 (My home #) (202) 514-2930 (My work #)
I'm looking for information on how to properly trim a mule hoof and a donkey hoof. Local farriers cannot agree on the proper way. Most want to leave the toes long, the mule and donkey cannot move well this way. How can we reach our farriers and educate them? Val Ewing rvewing@mwt.net
I am in favor of getting some x-rays, which will show you exactly what it will take to get the coffin bone bottoms ground-parallel. Mules and donkeys have somewhat steeper toe angles, and less difference between front and rear toe angles than horses. You also need to get frog contact in the back 1/3 of the frog, pare down to the dirtline alongside the front half of the frog, have bars short and descending rapidly, go for concavity depth (x-rays will give you an idea of how much concavity the coffin bones have), back up breakover...a lot of the same things you do for horses.
The pictures really brought the malady to light--just how bad it could be, and yet there's hope for a return to health. I have two horses with contracted heels, one with navicular syndrome, the other not lame yet. I'm beginning to trim. Can't quite figure out how to get those toes short without removing a lot of sole, so I'm not going there at this time. Working on the heels and bars, beginning opening cuts. Your web site has given me support in how to proceed. Thanks. Angela @ amh37215@ Yahoo.com.
You need to shorten the toes by backing up the profile; this will actually shorten the measurement when you lean a ruler up against the toe wall, even without taking anything off the bottom. This will also steepen the toe angle and back up breakover. Please study this wild horse cross-section from Jaime Jackson's newsletter:
This hoof will measure shorter and steeper when you use external measuring devices like farrier's hoof angle protractors and rulers. Note that without natural wear dubbing the toe and backing up the point of breakover--if the toe followed the "angle of growth"--the toe would measure longer, the toe angle would be lower, and the breakover would be further ahead.
Have you seen the web site www.jr-easytraveller.com They have a trailer design that has been developed to overcome stress in horses. They have also provided test results carried out by a vet that concludes the horse is far less stressed than when traveling in a standard trailer. They have overcome the problem with horses being propelled forward into the chest bar and have secured the horse preventing scrambling, etc.
How can this be? I visited this site, and all the horses are facing forwards in the trailers, which IS a standard trailer. Since facing the rear is one of the biggest improvements you can make in trailer design, I don't see how these trailers are all that much different and better than other standard trailers.
Hi Read article Section 13, Article entitled "Treating Founder(Chronic Laminitis) without Horeshoes". I don't recall any mention of the coffin bone coming thru the bottom of the foot. If this condition is present is it possible to use the shoeless approach??
John Henkelmire
@ whart1mindspring.com
I know of a number of people whose horses have lived through sole penetration, and grew new sole. Section 22 is an extreme case. Section 8 also shows some examples.
Hi Me again In Section 13 Page 2 photo Max. right fore,3-399 under note last line last three words:
"need opening cuts." Please explain TY
JH whart1@mindspring.com
Opening cuts for contracted heels are discussed in Section 14
Gretchen-- I loved your web site. Great pic's and WHOA.... what a mule! I love the before and after pics of your farm house. I really found your articles on treating founder very interesting and have printed them off to place in my "horse health book". I don't have any horses with founder, but know a friend with one and I was searching the web for her printing off articles. Thanks! Diane/Georgia/carusod@mi513.gordon.army.mil
Wow! What a great website! I plan to share this information with my farrier. I have a 15 yr. old quarter horse I bought 3 years ago, for pleasure riding, knowing he had navicular. The vet who pre-purchase checked him for me said "Aw, we can nerve him and he'll be fine." Well, he was...for a while. I was told to regular shoe him and have fun riding. Well, of course he became lame again after about 2 years. Now I have a different shoer who shoes show horses, but after 2 cycles, I don't really see any improvement. He says it might take a year to see any improvement. (at $125 a pop!) After reading much of your website, I think he needs to read this. Wish me luck. I see one person certified here in Texas - Uvalde. I am near Dallas-Ft. Worth. Anyone nearer to me????? This horse is awesome- I want to do what's best for him. Thank you for the education! Rachel in Texas Gimmehay@aol.com
Look up Rachael Ward Coggins, Uvalde, rcoggins@rionet.cc 830-374-5313. She may know someone else in TX to refer you to, also.
Past clinic hosts in TX for Strasser clinics:
Austin--Christina Blue, 512-281-3175
Past clinic hosts in TX for Martha Olivo clinics:
Dallas/Ft. Worth--Sue Briney, 972-294-2166
Dripping Springs (Austin area)--Patricia Cox, 512-264-2895
El Paso--Hampton Briggs/Laura Witt, 505-874-7778
Humble--Darolyn Butler-Dial, 281-446-7232 and Vicky Hudson, 281-446-7232
Wills Point--Sandi Jackson, 903-896-1198
Hi! I have been referring to your site daily....it's incredible! I will be discussing your barefoot method to my current farrier. I have a 22 yr.old Welsh Mountain Pony with chronic founder. Her last bout had sole penetration (cause unknown?). She also has "lipping" of p3,and a rotation of about 18 degrees. She now has hindquarter lameness (which looks more severe than her foundered fronts--x-rays reveal no founder in hinds) and I'm at my wits end. Euthanasia is not an option; she is still eating, moving around and acts happy. Her weight is ideal and her overall appearance is outstanding, but when she walks, she looks miserable. She currently has pads and a reverse shoe, which has given her some relief. This method is not working as well for her as it has in the past. She is on a diet of grass hay (minimal alfalfa mix), a small amount of crimped oats (just enough to mix with her vitamins and glucosamine/msm), and has free access to fresh water and a plain salt block. She is penned up with other horses on an overgrazed pasture (if it can even be called that). She was always trimmed regularly. I have done everything I could to avoid founder, but she was hit hard again despite my efforts. What section of your site would be the most informative for my farrier to read (he doesn't have internet access) I want to make copies of your method to give to him so he can use it for her next appointment. Also, I would like to get her sneakers. I just don't feel comfortable having her barefoot this winter after her p3 sole penetration. We live in Minnesota and our winters get quite icy! She is very "ouchy" as is with the frozen ground. Should I get her a custom or semi-custom fit. ANY advice would be greatly appreciated. (My vet is coming out next week, would it be a wise idea to have a blood test to check her thyroid function.....she has had two pregnancies in her lifetime in which both foals were about 3 wks premature....neither survived. Just thought maybe her thyroid could be the cause of all her problems). Thank you,
Andrea (and "Polly") e-mail.....casperhorsecrazy@hotmail.com
I am sending this on to Nancy Filbert, a hoofcare specialist in N. WI—Antigo. wenfil@newnorth.net Try to get hold of her by phone—not sure how often she checks her email, as she is very busy. She has dealt with more severe cases than yours.
Sole penetration is not a death sentence! The lipping of the coffin bone is the bone remodeling from long-term high heels and tilting of the bone. The first step is to get the trim so the coffin bone bottom is ground-parallel. You need expert trimming help soon, which is why I hope you and Nancy can connect. Nancy HAS worked in Minnesota before, so maybe this is doable.
If you are having blood work, get a complete checkup, including liver and kidney function, and insulin levels. Getting your feed analyzed, and maybe getting a hair analysis, will help guide your nutritional program. You also need to know if she has Cushings…although on the plus side, many horses with some Cushings symptoms have those symptoms lessen when they get good hoof mechanism going again. There is a Yahoo email list devoted to Equine Cushings: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EquineCushings/
I wouldn't breed her again if she is a founder patient and she has had problem pregnancies…or at least not until you really get her health turned around.
Hi Gretchen, Love the new format of your website. Wonderful to follow and full of fabulous information. All my people are well and barefoot and loving it!!! thanks to you. Always happy to share my very special stories (experienced thanks to you) with anyone who is interested. Many thanks again, Gretchen, best wishes from Jo from Down Under in New Zealand.
Vicky and Kaitlyn Orr from Murrumbateman Australia
Excellent site, extremely informative, and helps understand such a frustrating and heart-breaking lameness.
you can reach us at vicky.orr@bigpond.com
Hello, My name is Tammy. I am very interested in your work. I have a 15 year old gelding that has navicular and ringbone. It has caused him to develop arthritis. I would very much like to help him, so here I am. Please, can you help? I would like to know if there is someone in my area that does this. Please, help me help my horse. I appreciate any info. Thank You Tammy email: www.unonstuf@quixnet.net
Where are you? I have already helped you by putting up a lot of how-to information on the net. BTW, your email address bounced, so I hope you are getting this. There are some contacts on these pages:
www.naturalhorsetrim.com/Section_5.htm
www.naturalhorsetrim.com/past_hosts.htm
www.thehorseshoof.com/friends.html
Just a few days ago I learned my Appaloosa/pony mix has foundered. They say it has been coming on for sometime. I've only owned the horse for 1 year. I do, however, find your information quite helpful. I will be reading more of it.
Thanks, Teresa tmtx4@socket.net
What a great and informative site! My friend is a farrier and I'll definitely be sending her this URL to check out.
Very informative, I am researching chronic laminitis for a beloved mare.
Elisa M. Adams n2paints@msn.com
nice site.
brent
Makes sense, feels right. I applaud the amount of energy and focus you have put into your website - very informative and thorough. Thank you for your commitment to horses' well-being. Dr. Ric Powers; ric4liz@aol.com
Your website is a Godsend, thank you. Has anyone found a connection between Conjunctivitis and founder? My foundered Connemara has had a weeping eye since all of his hoof problems started (I realize now). I found a reference in McLeod's book on Equine Homeopathy. I've had his eye, sinus, etc.. checked out, all o.k. It comes and goes at times when an abscess appears. Dr. Strasser mentions the meridians in the toe in her book, there just seems to be a connection. Thanks for your hard work, Ellen Galt, esgalt818@earthlink.net
This is interesting--I am trying this now on founder. Debbie Jackson,S.C. JacksonHole1@aol.com
How can I get a copy of Dr Sharon Cregier's thesis, "Alleviating Surface Transit Stress On Horses"? Is there a web address that I can go to and download the report? David sales@easytraveller.com
You can get this from: To get a copy of Sharon Cregier's PhD. thesis on reducing transit stress in horses, contact University Microfilms Information Service in Ann Arbor, MI: 800-521-0600 or 734-761-4700. Costs for students ordering soft cover thesis copies is $40; for non-students, $59. This thesis has an extensive bibliography of other research. I do not think there is a free download, but you would need to contact them directly for more info. Gretchen Fathauer, gretchenfathauer@prodigy.net
Thanks to this web site and one other, I will be trying the barefoot trim. My gal of 24 years will not leave me yet! Thanks for all the great info, and the listing of qualified farriers. I will return with results, started on 10/27/02, joshlouise1960@wmconnect.com. Louise & Gyps
I am about halfway through it and have found it invaluable. Thank you - especially welcome were your insights into the variability of X-rays! I am struggling with a laminitic horse at present - will e-mail you some details as things develop. Thanks again, Lyn Williams pasada_house@xtra.co.nz
Absolutely amazed at what I have found out with your website. It's so informative--I feel I am at least a little bit knowledgeable on the subject now. We had had a horse with founder when I was a child--if only we knew what we know now. I have a small pony who last year had a bout of laminitis (he had had one years before, obviously) but still has the cresty neck. Can't wait to try the magnesium to see the results of his neck, with, of course, the natural hoof trims. Carolyn Borthwick'
CarolynJB@xtra.co.nz
Your website was my first contact with the barefoot method - and was a godsend to my horse. A friend told me I really needed to read this, and I was up all night! We started on this journey in the spring of 2000 and he is so much improved (navicular, ringbone, whiteline, delamination in toe, etc.). I have since attended two Strasser seminars, read hers and Jackson's books... I can't thank you enough for putting all the time and energy into this site - it was quickly accessible and led to so much information. There was enough information to convince me to continue to investigate - it really is the best one I have seen and gets into the meat of the matter. I know you have changed things, simplified and/or altered as time has gone on, and I (and many others) appreciate your massive efforts. Thank you! Barbara Blount-Powell, barbara@reasonabledoubt.org
I'm so glad that I found this site! Now all I need is a lot of help in getting my pony back on her feet. I hope and pray my farrier will listen and has the know-how to do this trimming on my little Annie. Is there a book I can purchase for myself and him to help us out with this? Tamra from upstate N.Y sunshinesara@usadatanet.net
There are a couple of Strasser introductory books available at www.thehorseshoof.com These go less into the specifics of trimming than the Strasser student textbook, though, which is very expensive--for ordering info, Click HERE
Hi, I'm reading through your web site in hopes of finding some tips for my mare. I have a 14 year old pony mare, 13 hands, who has chronic laminitis. I have sent your link to my farrier in hopes to find new ideas on helping her through her flare-ups.. She is extremely sore right now, and it's very hard to see her that way, my vet doesn't offer any kind of help, ideas or personal hits on this. In our area, we are very rural, its hard to find a horse vet. I've never heard, "well we could try...or well, this is how we could treat...I know it's not going to go away, but I usually...not always here if it's causing a lot of pain...you need to put her down"--nothing about treating, and that's hard to hear. No, I don't want to see her in pain, but I feel I need to try something to give her that chance.. I have read a lot, but still I have a lot more to read in hopes of leaning what, and how to help treat laminitis through trimming. My farrier is wonderful, a mother and son team, who are willing to check into this for me for the possibility of helping my mare, and I'm sure many others. Danielle Osentoski www.osentoski-pony-farm.com you will find my mare Goldie under medium/large pony brood mares email address is osentoski_pony_farm@yahoo.com
Gretchen: Thanks for all you do for the group, and thanks for adding the new info to Section 7. I'm learning in leaps and bounds! The guy I deshod in June is finally starting to become comfortable on gravel...hurray! Many many thanks -- Jan Maday in Purcellville, VA :o)
Excellent--no more need to be said!!!!!!.............................kaykaymd@aol.com
Thanks so much for your excellent trim site... I have been using this info for the past year to help my walking horse. First ...separation and flares, broken out walls and lots of stumbling and falling. Much better now, but still stumbles off of front left foot... hooves are very short and squared off in front, 50 degrees, the left wants to gain 2-3 degrees every 2-3 weeks. I suspect navicular due to the stumbling and reluctance to lift her front feet when turning. Have had chiropractic work for old neck and shoulder injuries. No feeling of lameness when riding--in fact, Beamer's walking has improved this past year. Thanks again, Norma Hall ... beamer4beat@yahoo.com
I have enjoyed your website. I have Strasser's second book and also have taken Olivo 2-day seminar--fabulous!!! However, the phone # listed on the healing slipper 606-381-9252 is not correct. Also, I am trying to find the sharpest rasp and the knife that is easy to hold and easy to sharpen--price unimportant. I have arthritis in my hands. Thanks for your help. Amy Findley dianasupremely@msn.com
Wonderful information!! I have an Arabian mare in Georgia that is on a pasture only diet. The grasses are Bermuda and Fungus Free Fescue. I have an digital photo of her taken over Thanksgiving if you would like to see her. She looks like a Percheron! and I am very concerned. My sister lives on the property where she is kept and we have taken her off the big pasture area and put in a smaller fenced area that has significantly less grass. My sister suggested Quiessence and that's how I found your website. Thank you for your help. Sherry Smith, dogwood11@msn.com. Bless you.
Thank you for your wonderful website! I have a 20 year old mare I acquired last spring. My farrier says she is foundered on one front foot. However, her heel is not high, she rather seems to want to grow a toe. Stone bruising seems to be an ongoing problem--she is constantly in pain. She has been getting vitamins, minerals and msm. My farrier did leave more toe than I would expect when he trimmed her. I'm thinking her foot should be trimmed to a configuration more like the horses in the photos with less toe. I have been trying to persuade her to be in the pasture with the other mares. I have been duct taping the sore foot with a piece of firm sponge over the heel and frog area to relieve her pain. She does get around better with it and she seems to have quite a bit of new frog growth. Any advice you could give would be appreciated. Maureen Johnson ldjrmjqh@netins.net
She could still have an under-run heel, even if it doesn't look all that high. It also sounds like she needs her toes backed up. Hard to comment on something if I haven't seen it, though. If the frog growth gets higher than the walls, you will have pain and bruising. I hope you can find someone who can look this mare over. Some places to look for contacts:
Section_5.htm
past_hosts.htm
www.thehorseshoof.com/friends.html
Martha.htm
It is sure a great web site that you have on hoof care for horses. I have a big Belgian and it sure helps me with my horse. So many things to know and learn, and you can here. Thank you for the web site. Jim. jknapp@arenet.net
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